Leah Feiger: Well, I mean, because the safer option. This is the richest man in the world and the President of the United States. I would like to believe that there is thought behind any of this.

Zoë Schiffer: 100%.

Leah Feiger: And that's exactly what a bunch of these conspiracy theorists have been saying over the last 24 hours. Senior reporter, David Gilbert, published a story today about how the entire conspiracy world thinks that the Musk-Trump breakup is a PSYOP, it's 5D chess. It's messy, messy, messy. We're talking posts of people just being like, "No, no, no, this is their plan. It's all to go the Democrats into publishing the Epstein files fully." It's kind of wild to behold, honestly, but I think we're about to see a bit of a fissure in Republican politics really for the first time in about eight months, nine months, they've had a good run.

Zoë Schiffer: Okay, I feel like we need to take a few steps back and just talk about how did we get here?

Leah Feiger: Is their relationship still useful to the other? Elon Musk is still the richest man in the world, and as annoyed as Trump may be right now, they have a lot of very still shared vested interests. Musk has a lot of contracts with the US government that he probably doesn't want to risk. They have some Qatari interests. There's a lot of business there, but this bill seems like it's becoming a sticking point. We'll have to see.

Zoë Schiffer: Right. And I feel like to that point, one of Musk's main, at least public grievances about it, is that it adds to the debt deficit, but also one of the provisions in the bill is that it reduces electric vehicle credits. Obviously, this is an issue for Elon Musk and Tesla. So how much of that do you think is impacting his views here?

Leah Feiger: Again, I can't get fully into his head, but as much as Elon Musk has been like, "Reduce the deficit, reduce the deficit, this is the goal of DOGE, we're going to cut $2 million," that don't even really exist in US federal spending. So in terms of cutting the deficit, it's hard for me to actually ascribe his motivations there. Does he care? I'm not 100% convinced. Does he care about Tesla? Absolutely, and you're exactly on the money with the EV credit. I mean, I think it was something last year, Tesla had spent at least a quarter of a million dollars lobbying on behalf ...